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#1 2014-11-05 01:31:24

paradan
Member
Registered: 2014-11-05

cutted MIDI note @ pitch-slide

Hi!!

Tested on: ZOOM H1 studio mic, MAC Reaper z3ta - Yosemite 10.10, headphones.

On video:
imitone is too fast if (my)voice changes a bit "color":

voice volume is from beginning to end constant and uninterrupted, sustained - only "voice-pitchbend-modulation":

https://www.dropbox.com/s/npgqhg8kysvru … e.mov?dl=0



I., (III.,)



(my) deep voice is sustained > microphone  :

Screen_Shot_2014-11-05_at_07.09.06.png

> imitone > to > DAW's MIDI IN:

Screen_Shot_2014-11-05_at_07.09.09.png

conclusion(bad):
-MIDI note stops when it can not determine the pitch
-MIDI note will stop when the sound changes "color"
-rock,hoarse voice tone => a lot of MIDI note cutting.
Solution(It would be good if):
-MIDI note stops _only_, when the volume drops below the minimum, and not the sound"color" change or can not determine the pitch.
-MIDI note stops _only_, if it is completely muted.

II.,

Physical problem:
Detect dominant pitch:  in melodic mouth percussions is difficult in low latency.

But, I have one idea to fix this:

in the first critical attack interval:
(in "percussion-interval" = voice attack = 1-100+x ms):
Solution:
less sensitive MIDI stop/start:
-MIDI note stops _only_, when the volume drops below the minimum, and not the sound"color" change or can not determine the pitch.
-MIDI note stops _only_, if it is completely muted.

I have tested all combinations of features - but not solved this.

before:

Screen_Shot_2014-11-05_at_07.22.15.png

in future fixed, soon :))) :

Screen_Shot_2014-11-05_at_07.24.29.png



III., (I.,) pitchslide:
@sustained pitch-slide:
-  a lot of MIDI note cutting, some new notes.

Have fun!!

Last edited by paradan (2014-11-05 06:37:34)

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#2 2014-11-11 17:42:47

Evan
developer
From: Seattle, WA
Registered: 2014-05-23
Website

Re: cutted MIDI note @ pitch-slide

Hey, paradan --

Based on the video, it looks like a malfunction is corrupting imitone's audio input.  What do you hear when you switch on "echo" mode?  (Wear headphones and click the headphone icon.)  My guess is that it's something very gnarly and broken...  If that's not the case, I would be interested to hear an audio sample of your voice to see where things are going wrong.

Be sure to update to the latest version, 0.6.1a, which solves some routing issues.  (0.6.1 only ever uses the last channel of an audio input!)

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#3 2014-11-12 17:57:28

paradan
Member
Registered: 2014-11-05

Re: cutted MIDI note @ pitch-slide

Hey, dear Evan!
In video-sample,My voice was a bit "rock" and not clean...! Hoarse voice is too complex, I know..
0.6.1a is much better! 
So,I have now only one "problem".
with long keept slides:

if i have a 2-3 sec long sliding voice, forexample :
when i'm do the slide: from  A#2 to C2,than - which is a long, continuous slided voice -,

      your product is cutting the input voice (single note) to more note, instead a continous one long MIDI note, and naturally,sliding pitch automation.

...is it possible to introduce a "legato"/sustained mode,
without note cutting at pitch-slided input?
something like that: Note ends only if I stop my voice abruptly,suddenly or short.

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#4 2014-11-13 06:46:29

Yragael
Power Tester
From: Belgium
Registered: 2014-05-30
Website

Re: cutted MIDI note @ pitch-slide

@ paradan, activate the pitchbend function in imitone for such glissendo
shortcut: Press P on your keyboard, or obviously click on the sine pictogram for activating pitchbend manually only when you need such effect.

also try putting the mic onto your throat and whistle or hum, it is very efficient.

about pitch bend, last but not least, use sound with short release because the pitchbend reset to 0 as soon as a note ends.
If you use long release sounds, it can lead to a mess and re edit the pitchbend automation.
Now I use short release with reverb or delay over it, and it works pretty well.

for Evan, my suggestion about pitchbend:
don't reset to zero as soon as a note is ending, rather keep the last pitchbend value taken by imitone and adjust only for the next incoming note.

It would give users the ability to use long release sounds

Best regards

EDIT: with pictures...
Pitchbend now:
718219imitone061apitchbendNOW.jpg

Pitchbend for long release sounds:
478015imitone061apitchbendOPTION.jpg

Last edited by Yragael (2014-11-13 07:47:43)

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#5 2014-11-13 09:39:06

paradan
Member
Registered: 2014-11-05

Re: cutted MIDI note @ pitch-slide

Hey Yragael:
I know..:(!!
I have activated Pitch Bend!!!!
But, will be later in background inactive, and active, and inactive.
If pitch bend is active works sliding only 1-2 semitone away,only in short time,and after this,or if more than 1-2 semitone: will be later in background inactive, and active, and inactive, and imitone product is cutting wider and / or longer sliding voice to more sperate note,
instead
only ONE continuous long sustained MIDI note + automation.

Last edited by paradan (2014-11-13 13:47:51)

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#6 2014-11-13 12:29:00

Yragael
Power Tester
From: Belgium
Registered: 2014-05-30
Website

Re: cutted MIDI note @ pitch-slide

one thing I've thought that could increase your recordings.

The minimum loudness arrow, raise it down to ZERO! it can help for sure for keeping sustain notes.

And be sure the maximum loudness is not too high + untick the yellow dot which automate the volume input.

hope it helps

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#7 2014-11-13 13:46:01

paradan
Member
Registered: 2014-11-05

Re: cutted MIDI note @ pitch-slide

Yragael: Not helps. I have tried all(!!!) mathematical possible options/settings/intervals variations before I submit my comment. But thanks.

The problem is now active in 0.6.1a imitone:
here, in my .::Studio::.:
NO mic problem (perfect,clean soiund)
NO min/max/average level-interval problem in software
NO input level problem in mic (optimal level)
NO noise problem (quiet room)
NO reverb problem (acoustically treated room)
NO feedback problem (output = Sennheiser HD25 ONLY)
NO calibration or settings or options problem (Soundcard setting,DAW control,etc)
NO voice distortion (clean voice acoustic)
NO soundcard problem (up to date)
NO soundcard firmware or driver problem (up to date)
NO DAW problem (up to date)
NO OS problem (up to date, legal copy)

This is Algorithm issue, not setting issue:
wider=(more semitones slide interval)
imitone is cutting wider and / or longer time sustained sliding input voice, to more, sperate notes,
instead only ONE continuous long sustained MIDI note + automation.

Thanks!

Last edited by paradan (2014-11-13 14:01:26)

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#8 2014-11-13 18:21:57

Yragael
Power Tester
From: Belgium
Registered: 2014-05-30
Website

Re: cutted MIDI note @ pitch-slide

I don't have the problem you describe, well not too often and whistling sustain notes works 85% of the time.
Here's an example of pitchbend in action:

https://soundcloud.com/mycorhize/imiton … ce-to-midi

Silly one but it shows well what we are talking about.

Note:
-The first raise down used one extra oscillator which is triggered on every attack.
-For the second raise down, I bypassed this oscillator and demonstrate how having a smooth bending effect without any interruption on the note.

The precision is all about me the user [you will hear it on this example ...rofl].

you have a problem and I do my best to help you.
I know how frustrating it can be!

Now, I always put the mic on  my throat for hum and whistle, it doesn't take the breath this way. I simply have to gain up the volume and it is good with headphones off course.
Much more efficient, I understand why Evan was telling to try this way in his first videos [during the kickstarter campaign].

My very first trials with imitone, I was singing shy... nowadays my neighbors ask themselves who is this man who sing loud, whistle like a madman or hum with a big sound for companion...


Best to you, I wish you success setting this marvelous imitone.

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#9 2014-11-14 07:07:41

paradan
Member
Registered: 2014-11-05

Re: cutted MIDI note @ pitch-slide

Yragael:

You have the problem too. :D Thanks for video:
This confirmed the relevance of the problem

https://soundcloud.com/mycorhize/imiton … ce-to-midi

[00:06,00:17]
This is in real one note.

And imitone cutted to 5 note. Very frustrating.
00:06 one new note
00:08 one new note
00:10 one new note
00:12 one new note
00:15 one new note
=
5 note. In real is only 1.

I will not use throat mic, sorry.

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#10 2014-11-14 14:39:18

Yragael
Power Tester
From: Belgium
Registered: 2014-05-30
Website

Re: cutted MIDI note @ pitch-slide

This is what I was trying to explain you.

This is not a problem, this is something to set in the instrument [vst or anything being midi].
When I remove the sound in the instrument that comes on every attack, the slide is near from perfect because there is only the sustain sound remaining, no problem with the attack anymore then.

I don't wanna tell a lesson here, let's understand each other.

By using imitone, I've learnt to choose the right instrument for the right use with this voice to midi.

If I want to whistle for melodies with pitch slide effects ,
then I will take an instrument with a smooth attack [which is not different than the sustain note].

I don't use a throat mic, it is a shure sm58 which I put onto my throat.
Why not trying it man? it can't hurt, well it is on your own off course.

Best to you

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#11 2014-11-20 16:39:25

Evan
developer
From: Seattle, WA
Registered: 2014-05-23
Website

Re: cutted MIDI note @ pitch-slide

Ah, so you want long pitch slides!  I feel silly for not understanding the question earlier -- it was in the topic title!  Anyway, that I can help with.

An explanation of the problem:  The pitch bend controller adjusts a MIDI instrument's pitch within an undefined and typically small semitone range.  It's most often two semitones, but can be one, and occasionally instruments use a one-octave range.  There is a feature to control an instrument's pitch bend range, but unfortunately many patches don't respond to that control -- so I use the safest value -- 2 -- by default.

It's possible to change the default range by editing the configuration.  (I may make it an option in the program later.)
1:  Open imitone.
2:  Turn on pitch-bend.
3:  Click in the imitone interface for focus, and press control-R to pop up its settings folder.
4:  Close imitone (do this NOW or the change won't take!)
5:  Open config.xml in notepad.
6:  Look for the line with the <Pitch ... > tag, EG. <Pitch mode="0" range="2" tolerance="0.25" transpose="-12"/>
7:  Edit the number after range= to be "12".
8:  Save the file.
9:  Open imitone again.

I've noticed that even with this setting change, you can only bend half an octave due to limitations (bugs?) in the MIDI sequencer -- for longer slides you'll almost definitely want some kind of legato instead (usually a VST feature combined with imitone's pitch glide mode) but I can look into making pitch-bend functional for multiple-octave ranges.

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#12 2014-11-20 18:06:32

paradan
Member
Registered: 2014-11-05

Re: cutted MIDI note @ pitch-slide

Wow, dear Evan, thanks! Works Perfect!!!

You have the best plug-in support in the world and you have the most progressive/innovative voice-to-MIDI/pitch-detect app in the world!
(Really, not just say;-))

Have fun, good luck in the future.

Last edited by paradan (2014-11-20 18:19:51)

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#13 2014-11-20 19:55:01

Yragael
Power Tester
From: Belgium
Registered: 2014-05-30
Website

Re: cutted MIDI note @ pitch-slide

Evan wrote:

It's possible to change the default range by editing the configuration.  (I may make it an option in the program later.)

ALLELUYA!

The other day I was wondering about that, how to pass the limit of 2 semitones? well here is the answer, thank you Evan!

Don't may... DO iT please, make it an option in the program, we must have this available at hand.
manual setting of the pitchbend semitones [from 1 to 12 would be perfect].
Users need it for the final release.

I'll try this tomorrow, too late in the night here for loud singing :o)

I feel some heavy fun with pitch bend and sick instruments with imitone over the incoming weekend.

Awesome

And glad for paradan who can finally enjoy the marvel!

Last edited by Yragael (2014-11-20 20:07:49)

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#14 2014-11-22 19:49:31

paradan
Member
Registered: 2014-11-05

Re: cutted MIDI note @ pitch-slide

Yragael, I wrote, not instrument/vst/etc. problem;-) So, only a bit "not save" xml "interval" configuration.
Now works perfect, finally here; the good long pitch slides too, if pitch is active, ofc. Thanks to Evan,and to youuu toooo!:-)

Last edited by paradan (2014-11-22 19:54:39)

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